Search Results for "1960 flying cloud"

1960 Flying Cloud 22′

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California | 22 T(D)SS 0NNN
D=Double-bed layout
T=Twin-bed layout
TD=Twin & Double
(same s/n’s as Safari)

In this era the T & D in the serial numbers denote the trailer bed layout. On this example, a “TD” version, there is a forward set of twins and a curbside double.

As you can see, the front beds serve as sofas, and the rear bed as a a dinette. Practical multi-functionality – until you have to make the beds up each evening and again in the morning…

What makes a California Flying Cloud instead of Safari? The usual Safari Layout has a front dinette, mid-double or twin-beds and a full bath across the back. A Flying Cloud usually gets a front sofa, or as shown here, less common front twins – yet you see some Safari’s with this same layout. Once again, model names many times mean nothing….

1960 Safari 22′

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Ohio Safari, but could easlily be a Flying Cloud or Caravanner

1962 Flying Cloud 22′

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Ohio | 22 2 T(D) NNN
22 2 F NNN late
(“I” prefix for Int’l options)

California | 22 T(D)SS 0630 to 22 T(D)SS 0875
(same serial number range as the Safari)

T=twin-bed layout; D=double-bed layout; TD for two full beds

In the early 1960’s, California & Ohio were still putting the Flying Cloud name on some of their 22 foot trailers in addition to the soon to be standard name of Safari. The Safari can usually be recognized by its dinette layout, but not always. Almost all had a model name badge this year.

1960 World Traveler 22′

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Ohio | I 22 0 NNNC
(same base number as Caravanner, Flying Cloud & Falcon)

Last year for the World Traveler. Next years Henschen axled 22 footers will not have a dual axle offering.

This is s/n I220245C. The interior wood has been painted, but have the typical WT layout of a mid double and full height chest of drawers, meant for extended travel and the stuff you have to take along to do so.

1960 Safari 22′

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Ohio | 22 0 226D to 22 0 408T
(I prefix for Int’l options)
D=double-bed layout; T=twin-bed layout; C-Caravanner
(same s/n’s as Caravanner)

California | 22 TDSS 0NNN
D=Double-bed layout
T=Twin bed layout
TD=Twin & Double
(same s/n’s as Flying Cloud)

Cost new in 1960 was $3850 for standard equipped, $4495 for Landyacht option equipped, and $4995 for International option equipped.

What makes a Safari instead of a Caravanner or Flying Cloud? The usual Safari Layout has a front dinette, mid double or twin-beds and a full bath across the back. Caravanners are only Ohio.

Other than the painted woodwork, replacement refer and carpeted floor, this California made Safari is original in layout and fixtures.

1955 Flying Cloud 22′

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Ohio | O-3245 to O-3293
California | 7NNN (about 7750 to 7975)

$3350-$3450(Twin) MSRP

2870# Empty Weight

First year for mechanical openers on the windows, the Flying Cloud was the only California factory 22 foot option that year, but in Ohio it faced competition from the similar Safari (O-6NNN) and “Panorama” (O-37NN) models.

The Flying Cloud didn’t have an actual model nameplate until the 1960’s.

This is California #7908

Price vs. Condition

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Vintage Airstream Values

The question that always get asked by newcomers and existing owners alike is, what is an older Airstream worth? There is no “Bluebook” for older trailers, and the N.A.D.A. Guide stops at 20 years. The premise is that beyond that point, the trailer is fully depreciated and any value left is intrinsic. Such value is very subjective, and can vary by current economic conditions, the geographical region and the desire of the seller and buyer. What I hope to impart here is an awareness of the thought process behind how to arrive at a fair price between a willing seller and buyer. This way of arriving at a price is based on the Market Value (“comp” value) method of appraisal. In our case, we take the determined value of the trailer in a set condition (benchmark value), and then subtract the costs necessary to make the trailer under appraisal equal to that trailer benchmark.

The idea is simple, but it requires time becoming familiar with values and costs.

Determining PriceTable A - Definition of ConditionTable B - Price Guide
Table C - Cost of RepairsTable D - OriginalityAirstream Price Trends


Step 1: Determine the benchmark price

To determine this benchmark value, watch the airstream.net, RV-Traderonline.com, ebaymotors.com, airstreamforums.com and airstreamcentral.com ads. Vintage trailers roughly fall into 3 categories: restored, average, & “as found” (see Table A). This is where it becomes important to not jump at the first Airstream you come across, waiting until you are familiar with what’s available out there. For the impatient, I’ve prepared a rough”guide” of Airstream prices (Table B). Couple words of caution:
Just because a price is listed in an ad doesn’t mean it sold for that price. I usually discount prices by 15% (for buyer counter offers) and don’t use obviously absurd prices. Prices will always be higher on ebay because you have greater exposure to a vast number of potential buyers with little effort required by both parties to initiate interest.
It is also human nature for people to understate what they bought something for, and to overstate what they sold something for. Take this into account when talking to folks about what a trailer sold for. Also, ebay prices can fool you. 1 in 5 sales fall through because the buyer backs out when they see the trailer, or never follows through. You have to watch for relists and feedback.

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Test Case Example: What is the value of 1961 24′ Tradewind, routinely used each season, but with deferred items needing repair, and determined to be just worse than Average condition. Per our Table B below, the benchmark for an average condition 1960’s Tradewind is $5500. If your fine-tuned research has shown “that a 1961 Tradewind sells for more than a 1968 Tradewind on the West Coast in the middle of winter”, then use your value here.

Step 2: Apples to Apples……..

If you were looking at a fully “restored”, “average” or “as found” trailer for sale, your homework is done – you’ve solved the “what is it worth” equation. But what if the trailer is somewhere in between, as is the usual case? This is the second step, subtracting the cost of anticipated repairs from the benchmark value. Once again, in order to keep from paying too much, you have to do some research. How much does it cost to have something repaired, replaced or overhauled? I’ve provided a table of shortcuts (Table C), but for those items where a price is not listed, multiply what you would expect the repair to take by the shop labor rate and then estimate parts and materials. Study the links to suppliers and become familiar with parts costs. The key is to assign a value to items that will need to be repaired – it will all average out. This is also the time where it pays to inspect the trailer from front to back, or to have had it inspected by a mechanic or Airstream knowledgeable person. Not only should obvious items be looked at, but also the originality and finish should be scrutinized. It is amazing how fast restoration and repair costs can add up, even on items that appear to be OK at first glance- after all, you are dealing with items that are 25 to 55 years old.

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This is where we now take our Tradewind example and adjust it for its shortcomings. Lets say it has a soft floor near the door, someone has installed a cheap plastic RV toilet, the cabinets have some water damage, the LP tanks are not current OPD, the trailer lights don’t work and the front skylight is a piece of plywood. Using the Table C, the total anticipated equalizing cost comes to $2200 in our example.

Step 3: Simple subtraction

Take the total equalizing fix-it cost from Step 2 above and subtract it from your benchmark value from Step 1. If you are in your right mind, this should be the price to pay for the trailer under scrutiny. But….it is very possible that you can end up with a price far below the asking price, or even a negative number! I call this the Airstream price/condition axiom. “The more perfect condition a trailer is in, with minimal deferred repairs and damage – the better the deal.” You will always come out money ahead by paying more up front and getting a well maintained Airstream in as good as condition as possible.

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Using our Tradewind example, we subtract the adjustment estimate of $2200 from the benchmark value of $5500, arriving at a fair market value price of $3200. This is a realistic price for a ’60’s-early ’70’s Tradewind in just less than average condition.

Step 4: Labor of Love

What if your net adjusted price is less than, maybe even much less than the asking price? You have three options.

  1. Make a reasonable offer, or
  2. Run the other direction – there are plenty of Airstreams out there, or
  3. Evaluate the acquisition based on what price you place on convenience and how it meets the needs of what drove you to want a vintage Airstream in the first place. This could be such things as the interior condition not being important because you plan to build your own custom interior, to the other extreme of the importance of a completely original but poor condition interior. Also, what if you are able to do most of the work yourself, paying only for materials and parts? Here is where the therapeutic factor and satisfaction of restoration and rescue come into play. If you are able to adjust the repair costs in Step 2 downward by excluding labor, then doing so will result in some of the less fortunate trailers moving back into the positive region; it then becomes a “labor of love”, instead of making economic sense.

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Using our Tradewind example again, let’s say the seller was asking $3500; you talk them down to $3200, leaving a spread of $700. The questions come down to:

  • Is this exactly what I’ve been looking for?
  • Have I looked at many Airstreams now, or is the first one that came along? Too many times buyers will buy the first trailer they come across, ignoring common sense and economics.
  • Do I have the talent and time to realistically do some, if not all of the labor?

These types of questions will or will not justify the difference between a sensible buy and the price of convenience.

A note about “For Sale” ad prices

The above exercise brings up the question, how did those sellers arrive at their price in the first place?

Sellers probably determined their asking price by doing the same thing you should be doing, studying what other trailers are listed for, and then setting their price higher or lower based on economic need and how they feel their trailer stacks up to other examples.
This is also where you can pick up “deals” – unwitting sellers setting low asking prices unaware of current market values.

Caution: if you see a trailer get relisted in ads, that is a good indication that the seller did not get their asking price the first time, and that first sale price should be not be counted.


Table A – Condition

“Average” Condition

The definition of “average condition” is:

  • The shell should have no more than one or two very small shallow dents, and no punctures or scrapes.
  • It is most likely not polished, and if the clearcoat is still on it, it may be peeling in locations.
  • All of the original exterior vents and doors will be present, and the windows should not be broken and should have working openers and close securely.
  • The interior furnishings (cabinets, fixtures, appliances & linings) should be 90% or more original and all in good condition.
  • The soft goods (curtains, mattresses & upholstery) may be worn originals to just recently replaced. This is the one area that makes no difference to value, since most everyone will replace these during a restoration to suit.
  • All the original appliances such as heater, water heater, A/C and refrigerator work. If replaced, they should be of appropriate size and design.
  • The electrical, LPG and water systems should all be fully functional.
  • The tires, including the spare, aren’t cracked from UV damage, and the brakes are in good working order. The owner should have invoices showing fairly recent shock absorber replacement and wheel bearing repacking.
  • External features such as utility connections and servicing ports are fully functional.
  • The sub-floor shall be solid throughout with no soft spots. It should have the original or replacement floor covering in good unstained condition.
  • Outdated items such as hydraulic brakes and split rim wheels may or may not have been replaced.
  • The trailer has seen regular annual use and care.

These are also the types of questions you can ask a seller to determine the condition of a trailer.

“As Found” Condition

The definition of an “as found” is a trailer having some of the following:

  • Larger or numerous dents, punctures or scrapes.
  • Missing some of the exterior vents, doors or windows.
  • Interior furnishings and features less than 75% original, or are water damaged.
  • Some of the original appliances such as furnace, water heater, stove and refrigerator are missing.
  • The electrical, LPG and water systems aren’t functional.
  • The tires, including the spare, are cracked from UV damage, and the condition of the axle components are unknown
  • External features such as utility connections and servicing ports are damaged or missing.
  • The subfloor has soft spots or rot damage.
  • The cabinetry or interior walls have been painted over in other than original finishes.
  • The trailer hasn’t been used or maintained in many years.
  • Modifications may have been done to the layout or systems.

Most of the trailers that end up for sale fall into this category.

“Restored” Condition

The Restored term is often misused (see “Renovated” condition below). Most Airstreams are in a state of “undergoing renovation or restoration”. Truly Restored means:

Interior

  • The interior layout is original, or is typical of the period and Airstream design (no computer desk instead of sofas, no wet bars, moon roofs or kitty doors).
  • Interior components are aesthetically original (may have improved function or internals).
  • Interior components and appliances have been cleaned, repaired and restored to a serviceable condition with no damage or degradation, using appropriate materials and methods.
  • Unique features, appliances & fixtures to that model and year should still be present, (LPG Lamps, Service Control Centers, Byam Burners and Panel Ray heaters are examples).
  • Replacements or additions to appliances and fixtures should have been done with correct period units, or with modern units installed in such a way they blend into the layout.
  • Cabinetry, shrouds and linings should be original or replaced using period materials and methods.
  • Cabinetry finish should be applied as per the original (painted, varnished or oiled wood). Interior wall linings should be as per original – green/tan paint (’40’s), Zolatone Paint (’52+) or Vinyl lining (’70’s).
  • Upholstery and soft-goods should be clean good condition and in period cloth or neutral/earth tones.
  • Any subfloor rot has been removed and repaired or replaced. Floor Covering should be clean and solid and from appropriate materials. Carpeting, Linoleum, or vinyl tiles are the norm.
  • The plumbing system should be complete with no leaks. The water system should supply water from an onboard tank through either a hand pump, demand pump or compressor as appropriate. The street water system should supply water to all the appropriate fixtures.
  • Wiring should be in a safe condition. Any modifications should be to code. Electrical fixtures should be original or period reproductions.
  • Potable water tanks should have been cleaned & disinfected. Any new tanks should be installed in an unobtrusive manner.
  • Toilet should be original or equivalent replacement (porcelain for porcelain, etc.)
  • Any new black or gray water tanks should be installed in an unobtrusive manner.

Exterior

  • Any major dents, scrapes and punctures have been removed or repaired, minor shallow dents are OK (small hail dents or bumps).
  • The exterior skin has been polished within the last few years. It does not have to be clear-coated. The panel edge seams and openings have bean neatly sealed with Parbond, Vulkem or similar sealant.
  • Belly Skin is complete and secure.
  • The original window weather-stripping is tight, or has been correctly replaced.
  • Window openers all work. All screens are present & in good condition.
  • Door works smoothly, hinge is in good condition, handles, locks & latches are in good working order, and are original or appropriate replacements.
  • Roof vent mechanisms are working originals or appropriate looking replacements.
  • Running gear (brakes, tires, bearings, shocks, springs) are in good working order and condition. Should have records showing servicing dates within the last 4 years. Wheels (rims) are appropriate with hubcaps (baby moon) or pie-plate hubcaps or spoked aluminum for the later models. It is OK to have the original split rim wheels replaced. It is OK to have original hydraulic brakes converted to electric brakes. It is preferable to keep the original hydraulic hardware in place.
  • LPG tanks have OPD’s and are polished aluminum or silver painted steel.
  • All exterior vent fittings are original or appropriate replacements.
  • Exterior lamps are working originals or newer historical reproductions. Trailer wiring works, and the wire harness is in good condition.
  • All exterior placards & nameplates should be present and have been repainted if necessary.
  • Tongue and bumper shouldn’t have any exposed rust and should be painted silver.
  • Any attached awnings are ZipDee or A&E, and are in good working order. Extra points for original or reproduction free-standing pole/staked awnings.
  • Step should be original, painted silver, and in good working condition.

“Renovated” Condition

This defines trailers that have been fixed up, but not with intentions of maintaining originality (see Table D). They are of the same functional condition as Restored, but don’t meet the originality requirements. Often these are used as a low cost family camper, specialized applications (live-in, office, etc), or are rescues of previously neglected trailers. They usually have layouts not found on the original, or have non-period cabinetry and finishes. Appliances and fixtures are usually modernized. The interior usually has been custom painted (non Airstream original). Valuation usually falls somewhere between “Restored” and “As Found”. How far is determined by how close the buyer and sellers preferences and tastes are.

“Custom Renovations” are classified as completed re-dos of an Airstream from the ground up like that from Vintage-Vacations and other full-time commercial restoration outfits – and can run from the high $30K’s to over $80K. Such re-dos rarely recover the initial cost of the mod when resold. Customized trailers are meant just for the satisfaction of the customer. Once again, when buying used, it will be the trailer that is in the best condition that will always be the best deal, no matter the price. If you can purchase one of these trailers, you will always be money ahead vs. paying to have it done on your own trailer.

Table B – Vintage Price guide

Every collectable book you open has a price guide in the back, so why not a website? They are not “official” or gospel, just the authors take on what he or she sees as ballpark prices for items. That sums up this table, and is intended to be just a guide for those who haven’t formed their own opinion yet of values based on experience. This price guide is based on adjusted sale ad asking prices and known sales from talking to buyers/sellers. Higher prices are summertime West Coast prices. Make sure to understand the condition criteria. Most Airstreams that are sold fall between “As Found” and Average condition. With that said:

CAUTION!! Do not use the values listed here until you have read and understand the text relating to condition and the items that influence price. Too many people are automatically assuming their trailer is in Average or Restored condition. Restored trailers are very rare, and unless a trailer has been well maintained and used, it will not be Average condition.

EraSize/Model"As Found"
(See Table A)		"Average" Condition
(See Table A)		Restored**
(See Table A)
Post War1940's
Pipe Frames
16' Wee Wind$2000 - $5000 $7000 - $9000 $15,800 - $18000
18'-19' Trailwind & Clipper$1100 - $2900$5000 - $9500 *
22' Liner$1100 - $1800$3800 - $7500*
The '50's(1951-1960)
15' Cruisette$2100 - $3800$5400 - $7000*
16' Bubble$2200 - $3290 $5500 - $8800$13800 - $20100
17' Clipper$1900 - $2800$3900 - $7500*
16' Pacer$2500 - $4800$5500 - $8800$13800 - $18500
18' Globetrotter / Caravel / Traveler / Pacer / Other$1100 - $3100$4200 - $8200$12500 - $18200
21'-22' Safari / Flying Cloud / Caravanner / Custom$1100 - $4200$5100 - $7800$13500 - $19500
24' Tradewind (1959+)$1200 - $2800$3800 - $7800$11600 - $18800
26' Cruiser / Overlander
$1000 - $2500$3900 - $7200$12000 - $18700
28' Ambassador$1000 - $1900$3200 - $7000$10500 - $18900
30' Liner / Sovereign $1000 - $1800$3200 - $6000$11000 - $18600
The '60's(1961-1968)
16' Bambi$1900 - $3800$5000 - $8800$13700 - $20200
17' Bambi II / Caravel$2000 - $3800$5200 - $8900$12900 - $17800
19'-20' Globetrotter $1600 - $2900$4400 - $8600$12600 - $17400
22' Safari / Flying Cloud / Caravanner$1000 - $2500$4700 - $8200$11900 - $17000
24' Tradewind$1100 - $2800$3900 - $7000$10900 - $16500
26' Overlander $1000 - $2000$3800 - $6500$10800 - $16000
28' Ambassador$1000 - $1900$3500 - $6000$11000 - $16100
30' Sovereign$900 - $1800$3400 - $6500$11000 - $17000
The '70's(1969-1981)
18' Caravel$1900 - $3800$5700 - $9100$14800 - $17600
21' Globetrotter$1500 - $3500$4800 - $8300$11000 - $16800
23' Safari / Caravanner$1200 - $2700$4670 - $7700$10900 - $16300
25' Tradewind$1100 - $2800$4600 - $7800$10500 - $16100
27' Overlander$1200 - $2300$4200 - $7700$10300 - $16500
29' Ambassador$1700 - $2300$4100 - $7500$10300 - $16400
31' Sovereign$1800 - $2400$4100 - $8500$10200 - $16900
31' Excella 500$2200 - $3500$4600 - $9100$10700 - $17100
 * Too few known sales to determine


Price Trends and “Value”

In the above chart you will notice a few things:

  • Current Market Trends (June 2010). Prices have been in turmoil the last 32 months. It may be that most used trailers are bought using cash or equity loans on people’s homes, both of which have been in short supply since the housing meltdown. On the for-sale sites, many Airstreams are going unsold at their asking prices, and eBay prices are not meeting reserves in many cases for nice trailers. As we got closer to 2008 winter and again in 2009, the number of trailers being offered for sale did not increase as it has in the past. With prices down in general, it may be that folks realize that the days of ever increasing prices (making a quick buck) are over for awhile, or are going to hold on to them and wait it out. We’ll keep an eye on the market this the 2010 selling season and look for changes in trends or to prices ranges. Prices have dropped remarkably over the last 3 years on larger trailers, especially those in less than ready to use condition. This may be attributed to higher gas prices, but may be even more related to the rise in interest rates and the reduction in the use of home equity loans and refinancing – the prime source of funds to buy and fix up a used trailer like an Airstream. It may also be the eBay crowd has found out just how much work and cost is required to get an older trailer usable again. Many sellers are also getting sneaky by over classifying the condition of their trailers, so buyer beware.
  • Prior Market trends. Prices for Airstreams rocketed upwards dramatically in the mid to late 1990’s, possibly owing to the rise of the internet and the ability to share information and find for-sale units outside of your local area. Prices then cooled off in the 2000 to 2004 timeframe as the economy cooled, except for small trailers, which have continued to slowly rise, especially those in very good condition. In 2005, prices in general had started rising again until the 2008-2010 gas/interest rate/equity loan issues. Ebay prices have actually stabilized over the last few years – maybe owing to the wising up of buyers on the amount of work and money it takes to fix up one of these diamonds in the rough. What is of note is the number of retreads you see on eBay, trailers that sold on eBay just a few years prior, but now back on the auction block in a little worse condition, with some interior parts disassembled, or with a half-hearted attempt at polishing a section of the trailer accomplished.
  • “As Found” prices rise as the trailer age gets newer. This does not mean necessarily they are worth more, it is because they are less likely to be found in as overall poor as condition as the earlier year models.
  • 1970’s Restored values are not as much as ’50’s & ’60’s models. This is because there are very few Restored examples, as they have not deteriorated enough to need restoring – most are still in an arrested state of decline at worst. This may change with time.
  • Restored prices are substantially higher than Average condition prices. **Restored or renovated trailers are rare, and are just a small percentage of the population. It takes a lot of time and money to make a 25-55 year old trailer like new. Most every day usable Airstreams will fall somewhere in the high Average value range.
  • Values top out in the $18K area. It is real hard to justify anything higher. If someone spent $2000 on a poor condition trailer and puts $25,000 into it….sorry, it comes back to my axiom of better condition trailers are the better value for the buyer.
  • Truly restored Airstreams rarely come up for sale – as noted earlier, most trailers advertised are usually “as found”, or are “undergoing renovation”.
  • When you get into the $10,000 to $18,000 range, each system must be in perfect working order, the structure has been gone through and repaired, all missing parts repaired or replaced, all surfaces are cleaned & ready to go, the trailer polished, and all soft goods are replaced – in other words “like new condition – ready to use, but using the old fixtures & materials”.
  • Another maximum limit is what new “equivalents” sell for. In the case of the shorter trailers, the 1998+ Bambi’s can be had for $12,000 used in like-new condition, and new Bambi’s and 22 footers are about $26K-$36K – that sets an upper limit that is unlikely to be crossed.
  • Another influence is new SOB’s (Some Other Brand). Conventional 17′-25′ travel trailers can be had for $14,000-$19,000 new – another price factor.
  • Rarely can a seller get their cost out of a completely restored or customized trailer. This comes back to the best values for buyers are the trailers in the best condition.
  • With the right market, with a small (Globetrotter & smaller) trailer completely restored & polished, the limit is about $19,000-$21,000 (Bambi’s included). Everything else is downhill from there. Large older trailers (Ambassadors & larger, Overlander’s to some degree) seem to attract the “park it” or “live in it” set, and there historically has not as much fevered restoration or nostalgia interest. That is changing lately, as many people are remodeling these larger Airstreams for use as cabins and guest houses.
  • Prices are higher in the Western US. Be it because of the weather, camping & travel opportunities, too much extra money, or whatever – it’s a fact of life.
  • Smaller trailers will usually bring more than larger trailers of the same vintage. This is because a smaller trailer is what is being sought out by present day weekend campers and travelers, and restoration of a small trailer is less a formidable task. Small trailers are equated with being easy to tow and easy to maintain. There is also a certain “cute factor” involved. Even Airstream has caught onto this fact with the introduction and success of the modern Bambi.
  • As recently as Oct 2002, a 1955 Flying Cloud that had been stored in a barn since 1960 fetched $23,000 at auction – in untested but complete original condition.
  • The recent focus on Airstream by such mainstream shows such as the 10 part restoration of a 1970 Overlander by the DIY Network has boosted the desirability of the longer trailers and 1970’s era trailers. Also, many people are becoming more savvy about the condition of the floors, and the amount of work it takes to restore the older trailers.
  • Don’t forget to factor in the cost of obtaining an Airstream when buying. Many buyers, thanks to the internet and ebay, have bought a trailer, only to find it cost $3000-$4000 to ship it across the US. Even in state deliveries can run $500+.

What’s this all mean? Condition and desirability. Highest prices for those in ready to roll restored condition, bought by people who don’t have the time or skills to do one themselves. Higher prices for good original condition trailers for people interested in restoring, average prices for neglected mostly original examples, and bargain basement prices for messed up and butchered trailers. The smaller the trailer, the higher the interest and price per foot.

Table C – Estimating cost of common repairs

ItemCost*ItemCost*
Polish external skin - per foot of total trailer length$110Replace Refrigerator$900-$1600
Strip Clear Coat - per foot of total trailer length$50Repair Refrigerator$250
Wheels - steel / aluminum$38 / $160Repair / Replace HW Heater$80 / $240
Tires - ea.$78 - $120Repair / Replace Air Conditioner $80-$160 /
$360-$600
Brakes - repair / plates$50 / $110Replace Toilet - porcelain$280
Shocks - ea.$24Window Opener/seals, per window$60
New Axle$780Skylight, 14 x 25$120
New LP tank OPD valves, ea.$45Zolatone Paint Interior$480
Dent removal - end cap (per dent)$1180Cushions, sofa - ea$320
Flooring, carpet, vinyl, linoleum - sq ft$3 - $12Mattress, bed$210
LPG Tanks, aluminum - ea.$130Repair & Gelcoat Fiberglass bathroom$200-$500
Repair / Replace Stove / Range$100 / $240Replace Water Pump$60
Replace Faucet$90 - $120Replace Curtains$300 - $600
Replace Upholstery$300 - $900Replace Flooring (vinyl) $500
Electric Tongue Jack $220New Propane Tanks, ea$165
LPG Regulator$60Replace Screens$120
Rock Guard$100-$325Replace Floor, Material Only, per linear foot$25
Tongue Jack, manual$75'66-'68 Corning Windows, Material Only, EA$220-$260
Overhaul Windows, Parts only - ea$45Replace Belly Skin, Material Only, per linear foot$19
RV Shop Labor for repairs per hour$50 - $65Bits & Pieces - Add up in a hurry!!$$$$$$$
Holding Tanks w/ Fittings$240 ea.
*Includes labor. These costs will vary widely by locality and the quality of the material/product used, and are for rough order of magnitude estimating.


Table D – Airstream Originality

I equate this to a little bit of history.

In the late 1920’s and early 1930’s, big ornate radio consoles were made by the tens of thousands. Post WWII brought about shrinking of radio size and improvement of the reception & operation. By the thousands the console radios were made into linen cabinets, spice racks, had their legs cut off or had their workings modified or replaced. Nobody thought otherwise – there were “plenty”, and these appliances were “outdated”. Today a Sparton Equisone or Stromberg-Carlson set can fetch from $800 to $1100, but one modified or without the original innards can be had for less than $100.

The same can apply to Airstreams.

There are plenty, but as each year passes, more and more bite the dust through neglect, export, loss and “modifications”. Let’s face it, it is the old-time quality and period looks that attract people to vintage Airstreams rather than a new trailer or another brand/type. I have been following Airstream sales closely for over 11 years now, and notice that a vintage unit in original and undamaged condition will generate quick activity and a sale. As many of you know, we were looking for another 1950’s 22 footer. We came across the trail of 5 over the course of a few months. 3 were in fairly original condition with few mods – and each had been snapped up almost immediately. The other 2 were still for sale months later.

But you say your 1960’s or 1970’s trailer is not in that category? No one will care if it is original? “There are 100’s of these trailers?”, and so on?. That’s what the owners of those old radios or the 1950’s trailers we looked at thought, too. For whatever reason that we who lived through the era’s can’t explain, the 1960 & 1970 interiors will soon be found fascinating, too. That doesn’t mean that the internals can’t be improved, or additions/modifications can’t be made using period materials & methods. Shoot, each Airstream was custom in it’s own way. For those who just have to have a modern or super-custom interior, there are many stripped out or heavily modified trailers out there, just ready for such a make-over……and they are much cheaper too.

That should be a hint right there….

Aluminum Fever

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Other Airstream/Vintage Trailer Websites

Postcard – National Trailer Park & Sales, Jackson Hole Wyoming – 1958

Aluminum Fever. That’s why you’re here – that’s why this website’s here. Below are links to other websites where aged Airstreams are revered and immortalized.

To add your website, or a website you come across, please contact us with the link. Also, please let me know of any dead links.

Sites with Airstreams For Sale are at the bottom of the page

Vintage Airstream ClubVintagetrailer club within the Wally Byam Caravan organization
AirstreamCentralNot Vintage focus, but still covers some Airstream concepts well
Wally Byam Caravan Club Int'lWBCCI and VAC membership starts here
Airstream LifeFull-color quarterly Magazine focusing on all aspects of Airstreams and Airstreaming
SilvaireArlen & Shirley did a thorough job on their 1964 Globetrotter restoration. Great polishing info, too.
Jim & Linda's Globetrotter'67 Globetrotter - and a Teardrop to boot
Vintage Deluxe Travel Trailers Images of many vintage trailers - and has vintage items and parts for sale
Tin Can TouristsHome page for the Tin Can Tourist organization. Always good rally photos
AirstreamTrailersSite devoted to all aspects of Airstreams: Blogs, Classifieds, ClipArt & Ezine
Doug's Vintage TrailersVery largevintage trailer & camping collection that rents to the movie & commercial industry
Les CaravaniersFrench site for trailer camping
Lashway's '56 BubbleMirror polish using Rolite products. Nice underseat A/C install.
Bowlus - Teller TrailersNot Airstreams, but old, close cousins
airstreamBohemiaSomething of everything vintage Airstream (kind of like this site)
Tom Patterson's PagesAirstreams, Streamlines, SilverStreaks, Curtis-Wrights, & the VAList and VAList Archives. Also, a gray-water tank retrofit installation. Be sure to also visit the Photo Gallery of member's trailers.
Sparton Trailers Not Airstream's, but in the same era with useful & fun information
Globetrotter Adventures Beautifully restored '63 Globetrotter
TimbermanA comparison of the hitch systems available
The Indiana ExperimentReal fun site displaying their 1968 Safari
AirstreamTrailersCollection of all sorts of links to Airstream related sites, Airstream e-zine
Airstream Cafe More Airstreams end up in Japan every month
Insideout-Design'64 Globetrotter ("Maxwell") restoration and excellent original fabric samples from the '60's. Very complete site
Atlas Vintage TrailersA great series of ads from vintage trailer coaches from the '30's to '50's
Lexxy's DewdropCustom redo of a '67 Safari, including fiberglass bathroom repair
Airstream ForumsPopular Airstream discussion list and online member community
Vintage Campers 1940's, 1950's & 1960's Trailer Sales, Restoration & Information
Tim's 1971 SafariTim did a great job of documenting his repairs, including such things as replacing plumbing, the univolt, floor and hot water heater
Hi-Yo SilverA restored 1965 Silver Streak plus a 1954 Flying Cloud under restoration
Airstream MotorhomesArchives of Airstream Motorhomes - Classics and Argosys
Amanda's '68 SafariIncludes photo essay on what happens when forklift and an Airstream meet.
1976 Argosy Frame off restoration that can also apply to sister craft Airstreams
Maxi-TearEclectic collection of vintage trailer get together's
Vintage Trailer ParkNot one, but three nicely restored Airstream trailers from the '40's & '50s.
VintageAirstreamerTeardown & rebuild of a 1966 Caravel - beauty can sometimes be only skin deep...
Airstream 4UAirstreams in the EU, and importers of Airstreams to Europe
Airstream HollandGreat way to practice your Dutch - includes what it takes to import trailers
Airstream Europe Plenty of information related to importing/exporting Airstreams to Europe - and camping in them there. Also see sister site for a ready to use Airstream Camp
RV-RestorationRough website to use, but great pictures on floor replacements - scroll down
Bluegrass ExpressDW Morrison's page. Be sure to check out the visit to South Jersey RV and the Clipper rebuild
Funky Junk FarmsSo. Cal movie prop suppliers and collectors of old vintage trailers & camping "stuff"
SnoManBlog for european import of a '66 Overlander and touring the Swiss & French Alps - the Grand Alpine Tour.
Vintage Tile ReferenceOK, its from Asbestos Research, but is has almost every 1950s to 1970s floor tile pattern in color
AirztreamBrad Norgaard covers the excellent restoration of their 1959 Tradewind
TrailerWorksPhoto documentation of 5+ vintage trailer restorations
Silver Streak JetA 1958 Silver Streak, plus Marvel Refrigerator and Princess Stove manual.
Boles-AeroSite for Boles-Aero aluminum trailers
Atlas Trailer DirectoryImage library of old trailer ads and brochures from 1930 on. Plus, send vintage trailer "postcards" from the website
Airstream JunkiesThey got one airstream and fixed it up nice, and then another, ...
Classic CaravansGermany Airstream rentals, sales & European conversions
Vintage Trailer CrazyHigh-end restorers - many pics of completed trailers
Airstream BlogVintage Trailer Supply rebuilds a 1956 Caravanner and documents the process in a blog
The VAPVintage Airstream Podcast. 1960 28'Ambassador restoration blog, too. Welcome to the 21st Century
Sweet Sovereign of the Road Rob Baker's excellent chronological photo blog of what it really takesto restore an Airstream. Start with the 2005 Archives and progress up
VintageTraileringDavid Winick Design - Designer of the 75th Anniversary Bambi for Airstream
1956 DaltonPage with images of my parent's canned ham I (RJ) grew up with
VintageTrailerArtArtwork from Paige Bridges featuring Vintage Trailers - does commissions. too
Wally Byam HolidayLanny has not one, but many of the little canned hams
Truly VintageEclectic source of Juergen Eichermueller vintage sales lit, parts, trailers & what not
Holland RanchTexas RV Park and Camping with Airstream accommodations available onsite
Auburn Trailer Collection Vince Martincio's unsurpassed collection of historic travel trailers
Summer of 1959 One family's journey across America in 1959 in an Airstream
SierraNevadaAirstreamslots of Airstreams info relating to vintage Airstream information and sites - plus restoration info and frame-off restorations and Airstream activities in the Sierra Nevada area. Explore the whole site, including archive sections
Pfredd.comDave Lowrey's site. Nice Solar installation instructions on an Argosy.
Tales of the Toaster The Nightmare known as finding out just what a vintage trailer can hide...
AtforeBlogging takers a little getting used to (the end of the story comes first). Airstream topic covers replacing the Bowen hot water heater and reusing the old shroud.
64AirstreamThe renovation of "Marlo", the 1964 Safari
SerroScottySource for information of the Serro Scotty line of vintage trailers, plus sources of vintage trailer information and parts.
Hershberger'sWith all the cool projects they have completed, it makes the rest of us look like slackers...
AirstreamListThe original Yahoo! Airstream Discussion List
Squob Web Magazine Thinking outside the white box camper.Slick web magazine featuring non-traditional RV's and camping.
Yesterday's Trailers Discussion group dedicated to repairing vintage trailers (the old VintageVacations Group)
The Trailer Company Florida Airstream Vacation Rentals & commercial use conversions
Andrea Hamilton Andrea Blogs about Airstreams & trailer life - updated about once a week.
Traveling Vintage Steve & Gail Powell's website about their 1965 Caravel and 1955 Safari
Sarah Jane English Airstreaming caravan source & information
Flying Cloud Squadron Patti's coverage of her, and other's Flying Clouds

Where to find Airstreams for sale

Healthy Homes Vermont rebuilder of Airstreams w/o chemical products. Sells ready to finish shells.
Outlaw Camping Used Airstreams (and camping gear) in Texas
Fred's Airstream Archives Airstream & Argosy Motorhome's too
TrailerWorks In South Carolina.  Ships overseas, too.  Good Restoration shops to boot
AirstreamGuy Mark Evans in Kansas buys and sells - and polishes too
Arizona Craig Many non-Airstreams too (Vintage Trailers)
VintageTrailerCrazy Always many renovated trailers available for sale
VintageAirstreams-Europe Airstreams imported, restored, and parts support in Great Britain
UsedAirstream.com Easy link into ebay Airstreams along with other Airstream articles.
Vintage Airstream Club The VAC of the WBCCI has a Classifieds section.

Wheels & Axles

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Q: I’ve been told my trailer has “Split-Rims”, and the tire dealer won’t replace my tires on them. What are these split-rims?
A: Split rims are used to describe a style of wheel popular up until the early 1960’s. The wheel consisted of a 2 part ring on the outside rim of the wheel. This was to allow easy replacement of the tire and inner-tube. The only catch was that if the ring was not seated correctly, as the tire was inflated it could fly-off with explosive force, injuring the person standing over the wheel. There are special cages to inflate such wheels, but most shops just have a blanket policy of no split-rims. The fix is to replace the rims with new solid steel conventional wheels. Click on below images to enlarge. You can see the spit rim ring seam at the bottom of the wheels.

Q: What size wheels do I use to replace the split-rims?
A: The standard for all single axle Airstreams, except the Bambi, is a 15″x6″, zero offset with a 6 lug pattern on 5.5″ spacing, rated at 2600#. A properly rated Chevy truck wheel will meet this sizing, too. Don’t use underrated car wheels. The desired color for originality is a black wheel.

Q: My wheels are 14.5″ in diameter, but look original – are they?
A: They most likely are. Airstream offered the smaller diameter wheels as an option in the 1950’s for buyers with automobiles to match the lower hitch heights. Often called “low-riders” today, many folks swap these out with standard 15″ rims to gain a little more ground clearance, but here is nothing wrong with leaving them as is. Finding tires may be an issue though.

Q: My Airstream doesn’t have any hubcaps. Where can I get some?
A: Depends on your year trailer. If it still had the split-rims wheels, the moon style hubcap has spring-clip that slipped inside the wheel center – these are no longer available and are hard to find. If you have conventional wheels, the style up to 1971 was a baby moon style of hubcap. 15″ wheels use a 10 1/4″ ID and 14″ wheels use a 9 1/8″ ID style. You can find them at any utility trailer dealer or on eBay. The later style hubcaps show up on eBay all the time.

Q: I’m not sure of what size tire to get for my trailer, as it seems the original sized tires are not readily available. What should I do?
A: Best bet is to get the trailer to a dealer, provide them with as much information as you can, and let them match, mount and then install the tires. That way if there is an issue, they are responsible for making the tire fit. Generally, the tire used on the older trailers were 7.00 x 15 LT (Light Truck) 8 ply bias ply tires of the era. Some exceptions are the small 16 to 18 foot trailers, which used a 6.70 x 15 LT tire, as did some early tandem axle trailers.
ST type (special trailer) tires weren’t available back then – the same with radial tires. The ST has a stiffer sidewall than a passenger car radial and has UV inhibitors in it – not really an issue if you use the trailer at least 6 times a year to release the friction activated inhibitors, and protect the tires from the sun while in storage. Radials were used, usually the 225SR15 and 205SR15 sizes once they came out in the ’70’s. You can retrofit radials in some cases where clearance is not an issue, but it is recommended to use the ST type, as the average radial sidewall flexes too much when used on a trailer.

Q: What style are these axles on my trailer?
A: Until 1962, axles used on airstreams varied greatly, from the cast cross member leaf-spring “Model A” type axles of the ‘40’s and early ‘50’s, to the heavy duty leaf-spring tubular type specialized trailer axles of the mid and late ‘50’s, usually by Hadco. In 1961 Airstream introduced their own unique suspension assemblies which were called Dura-Torque. Later, the suspension manufacturing unit was sold along with the design and rights. It became Henschen Mfg, and is located in an old building several blocks from Airstream in Jackson Center.
This new design was a square tube (axle) with a smaller square steel shank with two 90 degree angles (suspension arm) inserted into the larger tube. Cushion and support is provided by four approximately 12″ long round rubber rods of approximately 1/2″ diameter inserted between the flat side of the suspension arm and the corners of the square axle tube. The rods are temporarily placed in a super cooling freezer beside the work station, using liquid nitrogen to shrink the rubber rods. The rods are quickly removed from the freezer, placed by a gloved hand against the suspension arm, and the arm with rods are shoved into the axle tube. The weight ratings of the Henschen Dura-Torque axles are determined by the diameter and hardness of the rubber rods. To this durable but smooth riding system, conventional shock absorbers are then added for additional ride dampening.

Q: Do these Dura-torques wear out?
A: Yes. The rubber rods eventually will take a set from their own weight and just sitting. High-mileage trailers, or those left out in the elements can suffer from deterioration of the rubber rods will wear out even faster. There isn’t any hard and fast rules. There are early ‘60’s trailers with plenty of spring left, and 1970’s trailers that are shot. When the ‘spring’ goes from these axles, going over bumps and pot-holes can result in the torsion arm coming up and hitting the stop there to prevent the wheel from contacting the wheel-well or the rubber rods from being displaced. This jolt and not only shake up your packing, but can weaken the frame and trailer structure and skin joints.

Q: How can you tell if the Dura-torque axle is worn-out?
A: This is going to vary depending on who you talk to. A good rule of thumb is that the trailing torsion arm shouldn’t be angled upwards past horizontal when the trailer is fully loaded. A good second opinion verification is to put masking tape or sealant on the up stop. If the stop gets hit during routine travel, you will be able to tell, and your axle is a candidate for replacement.

Q: You had a 1965 Axle break on your Caravel. Do you recommend replacing the Dura-torque Axle precautionary?
A: If you have a pre-1967 axle with non-tapered inner bearings, I would recommend replacing the axle. More info in this restoration topic section. Also, any axle older than ~1978 is going to have the rubber rods pretty much worn out and should be evaluated for replacing anyway.

Q: If I have to repair/replace my Dura-torque axle, what are my options?
A: Henschen no longer repairs the older Dura-Torque axles, replacement is the only solution (Airstream Dealer). For experienced restorers, you can spec out a new torsion axle from Dexter or Axis Products, but you cannot order, say “an axle for a 1968 Safari”. More info in this restoration topic section.

Q: What about the older leaf spring axles?
A: Here you have many more choices. The axle components can be replaced or repaired using conventional auto/trailer parts, such as leaf springs, brake drums and brake parts, shocks, hubs, bearings and wheels. If an axle is too far gone (rusted or broke) a new Dexter or Hadco axle can be attached, or a new torsion axle can be retrofitted. See this Restoration Resource section for alternatives and the replacement we did on our Flying Cloud.

Q: The small 13 inch wheels on my Bambi are not split-rims, but the hub caps are no longer available, what can I do?
A: These wheels were actually low cost 4-lug Ford Mustang/Falcon wheels of the era. Replacements are usually made using Dexter wheels and moon hub caps just like the bigger trailers. As an option, you can usually go up to 14” wheels and use P185/75R14 tires and have just enough wheel-well clearance.

Q: What if can’t find parts for my small Bambi axle?
A: Replace the axle with one from Dexter. The old axles have a 10″ brake drum with 4 bolts. That pattern is no longer available. Use the 10″ drum with 5 bolts and get the new Dexter matching wheels and Moon hubcaps. The new axle actually fits the frame better than the old one. Installation only requires that new holes be drilled in the frame rail. The new install is actually cleaner than the old one.

Q: What is a Pipe Frame” Airstream?
A: “Pipe frame” Airstream trailers were built from 1947 to 1950, and usually have both or one end rounded with a single wide oval window on that rounded end. Travel trailers back then were built very light with few appliances and furnishings, so their frame could be relatively lightweight. The pipe frame was strengthened slightly in 1949 by adding another 3′ section of pipe inside the front most 3 feet near the hitch. But the frame soon became insufficient for the added weight of larger trailers with more stuff installed and loaded inside.
The “pipe frame” was also called a “Centerpole” by Airstream. The frame is like a fish skeleton: a longitudinal center rib with outriggers to both sides. The outriggers are not all that strong and cannot take too much weight being placed on them, other than above the wheels, which has some additional framing to attach the axle. You will typically see the appliances mounted in the center of trailers, usually above or just forward of the wheels, as that is best for weight distribution. If the small brackets that secure them to the centerpole become detached, you can (it has been done!) pull the centerpole right out the front of the trailer.
The first ladder frame Airstream with a “A” frame up front appeared in mid 1949. It was the 24′ “Unlimited”, soon to be renamed the “Cruiser.” By late 1950, all new Airstream trailers were built using the ladder frame.
The pipe frames are still OK if not rusted inside the tube, the outriggers have not become detached, if the trailer is kept light and not overloaded, and if you avoid using weight equalizing bars. To see what a Pipe-Frame looks like, check this ’48 Liner page.

Q: My leaf-spring axle has hydraulic brakes, can these still be used?
A: More than likely the axle was made by Hadco Engineering, a supplier to Airstream in the 1950’s. You can either maintain the brakes as hydraulic, which can be done with the use of a hydraulic actuator mounted somewhere on the trailer, or you can replace the axle. Both hydraulic and electrical components are still available from Hadco. The old Stromberg slave cylinder, parts and fittings are not made anymore, though. Hydraulic actuators are available from Carlisle.

Q: What is “rear end sag” or droop?
A: It is a chassis to shell separation on longer Airstreams, usually Ambassadors and Sovereigns prior to 1982. It was caused by the installation of gray (1973+) and black water tanks, along with the battery and weight of the bathroom fixtures in the back end of these long trailers. This combined weight, especially when the trailer was towed with the tanks left full, caused the shell to separate from the frame in the back from all the dynamic flexing, and ultimately bent the frame just aft of the wheel wells.
The fix is to install Airstream bulletin #29. It consists of two perforated plates, notched and pre-drilled to fit over the axles on both sides. You need to go through an Airstream dealer or authorized repair service to have the work done. If the shell is detached from the frame or the frame is bent, that will have to be corrected also. The bulletin is in the VAC Online Library if you wish to see if the mod has been done to your trailer. Ways to recognize the condition is to stand on the bumper and see if the frame moves and the shell doesn’t. Other sure signs are loose interior partitions and cabinets, or a 45 deg bulge in the side of the skin just aft of the wheels.

It can occur on other models of trailers, but is usually caused by the floor rotting in the rear of the trailer, and the C Channel that attached the upper and belly skins to the wood floor coming loose from the floor.

Q: What is the best way to replace the old worn electric brake parts? How often do I need to grease the wheel bearings?
A: Use a loaded backing plate, replacing the entire brake assy at each wheel. It consists of the magnet, brake shoes, springs, etc. mounted on the “backing plate”. There are several advantages to loaded backing plates. Often the cost of the individual components meets or exceed the cost of the complete unit. The process for replacement is: undo the 5 (or 4) bolts and two wires. Reinstall, connect wires, which do not need to be connected in any certain way, reinstall hub/drum and adjust. You’re done. You will now have all new springs, brake shoes and a current style magnet.
It also makes sense to repack the wheel bearings at the same time. A tip for removing the grease seal. Pry off the dust cap, cut and remove the cotter pin, remove the castle nut and washer, remove the outer bearing, replace the washer and nut, pull the hub/drum toward you allowing the washer to bear against the inner bearing, pulling with a sharp movement nearly always dislodges the inner bearing and seal with no damage to the bearing. Pack the bearings per this Champion article.
Another area that you need to be aware of are the different grease seals available. Many RV outlets have a simple single lip seal that will fit in Airstream axles. Airstream does not use nor do they recommend the use of single lip seals. Their recommendation is to use double lip seals only. They may be a little harder to find is a small price to pay for the added security.
The original P/N was a National 291148 felt seal and 292100 in the ‘60s Henschen axle. The 292100’s are available from OasisRV. The TCM 21325TB is a good substitute for the 291148. It is a double lip seal, also.

Q: What shocks should I use?
A: Except for later model tandem axles, conventional heavy-duty auto and light truck shocks are correct. Take a shock to an auto parts store so they can match the ends, stroke & length.
With the big body style change in 1969, Airstream changed to a horizontal mounted (trailing arm) shock absorber configuration. They can also be found on some later ’60’s dual axles.
What makes the new shock special is: “The shock used in the horizontal mount is a specialty shock built for Airstream by Gabriel. The difference is a bladder is used to hold the oil on the piston. The typical design of shocks would allow the oil to pool away from the piston leading to premature failure.” This shock is the one you need to get from Airstream dealers. While a conventional shock can be made to fit, you can see it may eventually fail.

Q: How do you carry a spare tire?
A: Either in the tow vehicle, under the bed if you have an external access compartment, or by one of these ideas:
http://www.airmarktools.net/services/airstream-parts/index.html
https://vintageairstream.com/photo-archives/1959-world-traveler-22/ (This was original from Airstream)
https://vintageairstream.com/1965-caravel-index/after-tour/#details This last one was made from C channel used to hang ceilings in commercial buildings, and was bought in 1965 (commercial made) from the Airstream dealer.

Q: Are two axles better than one?
A:Depends. Modern trailers usually always have 2 for a couple of reasons. Manufactures can use 2 lower cost, lighter weight axles, wheels & tires than the more expensive heavy duty single axles. 2 axles are more stable and the trailer tracks straighter. A tire blowout can result in a easier to manage condition, you can even remove a blown tire and proceed slowly on the remaining tire to a service station. The downside? You have 2 of everything. Twice the cost of maintenance – tires need to be replaced every 7-8 years, bearings repacked every 3 years. When fixing up an older trailer you may have to replace the axles – again twice the cost. Single axle trailers are more maneuverable and have more interior storage (less wheelwell size). As you can see, there is no clear answer.

1962 Safari 22′

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Offered the same time as the soon to be extinct Flying Cloud, the Safari layout in the early 1960’s still usually consisted of a front dinette layout.

California version shown here.